Glenn E. Wheeler
Glenn sent along these text files that include full notes:
Ed1.txt is Edward Wheeler and Mary Dutcher, daughter of Gabriel DUTCHER and Elizabeth KNICKERBOCKER
Gert.txt is Gertrude Wheeler and Laurence Dutcher, son of Gabriel DUTCHER and Elizabeth KNICKERBOCKER
Samuel.txt is Samuel Waldo Dutcher who if I were a betting man would think was a son of Lawrent Dutcher and Mary Waldo
21 Oct 1997
Subject: Laurence Dutcher and Wife Catherine Wheeler and their family
Many folks seem to quote the Dutcher Genealogy (griffin) and point out potential or probable errors. I have several on the Dutchers as they relate to my Wheeler family. I'll post them as indivdual items. Any comments or thoughts on my data analysis would be appreciated.
First Item is individuals #324 Lawrenze Dutcher, son of of Gabriel Dutcher and #330 Catharine Dutcher daughter of daughter of the same Gabriel Dutcher. I believe #330 is DAUGHTER of #324 and his wife Gertrude Wheeler. Rationale below.
I'll quote - Wolcott Genealogy, The Family of Henry Wolcott, One of the First Settlers of Windsor, Connecticut. Sponsored by The Society of Descendants of Henry Wolcott, Incorporated. Compiled and Edited by A. Bohmer Rudd. The Guild Publishing Company, Incorporated, Washington DC, 1950. Located at the Sons of the Revolution Library. (I found it to be very good - but it DID not provide the actual substantion data).
Also at the Sons of Revolution Libary in Glendale California, I found in the family folder section what appeared to be a post which said, "4588 - - Dutcher - - Wheeler - - The Dutcher-Wheeler families of Armenia (Sic), Dutchess Co NY are my own families. Would you be interested in the exchange of vital records? Doesn your Dutcher line go back the the Knickerbockers? If so, it may be the same as mine. I am looking for the parents of Gertrude Wheeler, who m. Laurens Dutcher 1761 and the list of all their chn. and where and when b. My Katherine Dutcher, of which there were many was either the sister or daug. of Laurens Dutcher. One genealogy gives her as the sister b.1749, but since my grandmother, Hannah Woolcoot (her dau.) was b. 1806, this could hardly have been. There was a Catherine in every family, nearly. I have some Wheeler data an am now in . . . (other topic). . . . Mrs. Harry John Miller 2223 Rucker Ave. Everett, Wash." [I have tracked the writer of this letter down as Mabel Ingersoll, b. 17 Mar 1874 she wasthe granddaughter of this Hannah]
The Woolcott Genealogy is very interesting and helps to substantiate the data I have by providing information that William Woolcott was married first to a Sarah Elizabeth Wheeler [I have no idea who she is - does anyone?] and they had one son a Lawrence. He then married Catherine Wheeler who was born in 1762 [per woolcott] I do NOT have a birth reference for her. The Wolcott genealogy also states they had a son (Laurence and Catherine) named Wheeler.
On 27 Mar 1785 a Baptism occurred for Sebastian Wolcott, son William Woolcutt and Catherine Dutcher in Dover. (Other source gives a brith date of 13 Dec 1784). Sponsors were John B. Wheeler and Ruth Sampson.
[John B. and Ruth are my direct ancestor]. Reference NYGBR 1902, Records of Amenia NY Church.
On 5 Nov 1761 [same source] Laurens Dutcher married Gertrude Wheeler in South Amenia.
On 21 Aug 1743 at Red Hook Lutheran Church [ref church records], Gertrude Wheeler daughter of Sebastian Wheeler was Christened.
This Sebastian moved from the Red Hook/Columbia Co area to Dover around 1750 or so at about the same time as his brother Ephraim. They were the only Wheeler's in this area. There was a DIFFERENT Wheeler family up in northern Amenia with names such as Noah, Eliphalet (pretty standard English names). The only Gertrude in the area of this Church was Gertrude daughter of Sebastian. Ephraim's Will [Dutchess Co Wills] lists all his children - No Gertrude. Sebastians Will notes that he has 8 Daughters and one son - John B. Wheeler [He was the youngest of all the children and was born in 1766].
Putting all the above together - Information that Catherine who was born in 1749 had a duaghter in 1806 (pretty close to impossible) nullifies the Dutcher Genealogy placement.
It would appear that Catherine Dutcher daughter of Laurens Dutcher and Gertrude Wheeler named her first child [not her husbands first as he supposedly was married before to a Sarah Elizabeth Wheeler and named a child Laurens] after her Grandfather Sebastian Wheeler. Further she uses her ONLY male uncle and his wife [John B. Wheeler and Ruth Sampson] as the sponsors for her son.
If you have done research into these Dutch/German families, you must know how important the sponsors were in baptisms and they were pretty much family. Naming was also pretty much based on family members.
Anyways - thats my proof. (At the very least - it should call into question the Dutcher Genealogy on this subject).
Hope this helps someone or if I'm wrong please let me know as it will help my Wheeler Genealogy.
Second Item:
For ease of things when I mention DUTCHER I am referring to Grffins Dutcher genealogy. When I refer to WHEELER, I'm referring to the History of Wheelers in America by Albert Galatin Wheeler, 1914. (It's a tremendous book but does have somemistakes)
ALSO NYGBR - New York Genealogical and Biographical record.
ITEM #1
Maritje Dutcher (#326 daughter of Gabriel Dutcher) and Edward Wheeler
DUTCHER lists three sons John, Edward , and Enos and references Amenia.
WHEELER also lists these same three sons (Entry # 15643) but also gives dates.
It appears that either WHEELER copied data from DUTCHER or both made the same mistake. The item DUTCHER refers to is Amenia NY church records in the NYGBR of 1904. These records have both births and marriages.
Unfortunately, births are recorded in the more New England fashion of ONLY listing the Fathers name followed by "and wife" . Thus if there is more than one male with the same name its hard to tell who is who.
DUTCHER and WHEELER made the same mistake. There are multiple Edward Wheelers in Amenia/Dover. (Edward was the name of the original Wheeler for this family who married in 1689. Consequently numerous Edwards.).
Two areas confirm this. My research into this (whatever its worth) and the WHEELER-PITTMAN FAMILY BIBLE: Extracted 26 Jun 1990 at NY State Libary by Glenn E. Wheeler. Extracted from DAR Bible Records 929qD23 Vol 7, pages 227-229.
EDWARD #1(Edward Wheeler and Mary Dutcher)
The first Edward to discuss is Edward Wheeler and Mary Dutcher.
They are directly out of the Wheeler Pittman family Bible and list there children as:
1. Catherine WHEELER was born 18 Sep 1765 and died Jun 1848.
2. Rufus WHEELER was born 19 Sep 1767.
3. Lydia WHEELER was born 6 Mar 1770.
4. John WHEELER was born 13 Nov 1772.
5. Ephraim WHEELER was born 11 Feb 1775 and died 15 Sep 1841.
6. Edward WHEELER was born 23 Nov 1777.
7. Mary WHEELER was born 14 Feb 1781.
8. Abigail WHEELER was born 18 Mar 1784. She died 2 Jan 1869.
9. Eleanor WHEELER was born 24 Jul 1787 and died 7 Jan 1859.
10. Sally WHEELER was born 26 Jun 1790 in Amenia, Dutchess, NY. She died 11 Jul 1840 in NY.
The "OTHER EDWARD WHEELER"
Marriage: On 3 Jan 1774: Edward Wheeler of Red Hook and Elizabeth Wheeler are married. (MY - Comment: Most likely cousins or something.
Also, she must have been from Dover/Amenia for it to be noted he was of Red Hook).
The three Edward baptisms at Amenia are:
Bapt: 25 Dec 1777. Edward Wheeler and wife had John (formerly of Livingston's manor) at Mr. Silas Belding' Dover. - Since 4. above was born in 1772 and it also state he was formely of Linvingston's manor - I attribute this John to the "Other" Edward. (I'll include this other Edward at the end of this message).
Bapt: 4 Mar 1778. Edward Wheeeler and wife had Edward, b. Nov 23, 1778, Eph. Wheeler, Sr. Sponsor. This is a son of the Edward and Mary Dutcher. [ A) Ephraim Wheeler - Grandfather was sponsor. b) Date (at least year) is identical]
Bapt: 29 Aug 1780. Edward Wheeler and wife had Enos, b. 16 Jul 1780.
Since he is not listed in the bible I have placed him with the "OTHER" Edward.
Bottom line is Griffin is mistaken in placement of children of Edward wheeler and "wife" and only one of these should belong to Edward Wheeler and Mary Dutcher.
If anyone has any more data on these families or corrections please let me know as it would help in my Wheeler Research.
Comments by Fran:
<< Bottom line is Griffin is mistaken in placement of children of Edward Wheeler and "wife" and only one of these should belong to Edward Wheeler and Mary Dutcher. >>
Hi Glenn,
Sure glad you wrote to the group because some of the questions you raise are ones we have struggled with in the past. I am a bit confused, however. Are you saying that these are NOT the children of Edward and Mary Dutcher Wheeler? Or are you saying this is the wrong Edward but the other children are correct?
I have quite a few Wheelers and they are not connected together into groups with their parents. Would it be possible for you to give us a few generations of your Wheeler info so we can compare with what we have and link some of our Wheeler spouses to their families?
Several of us have puzzled over Catherine Dutcher and daughter Hannah Wolcott. Are you secure in placing Catherine as d/o Laurens Dutcher. Did Laurens also have a sister named Catherine?
I sure appreciate the information you have shared with us.
Thanks,
Fran Daniels
Fran and group,
Clarification on previous email and your questions.
A) ALL the children in the Wheeler-Pittman family bible are EDWARD WHEELER and MARY DUTCHER.
Griffin unfortunately ASSUMED that all three parent entries for Edward Wheeler's listed as parents in the Amenia NY Church records was Edward Wheeler (who was married to Mary Dutcher).
unfortunately he was in error. There was two Edward Wheeler's. Two of the Amenia NY Church Baptisms (John and Enos) are for children of Edward Wheeler and Elizabeth Wheeler (Maiden name was Wheeler). Only one of the three entries was for Edward Wheeler and Mary Dutcher (Child Edward).
B) How sure am I on the Catherine Dutcher who was mother of Hannah Woolcott as a daughter of Laurens Dutcher. I'm pretty sure that this is correct. Hannahs granddaughter was still alive up through 1950 - She appears to have been very active in genealogy and had pulled things together up through Catherine and had decided that Laurens was either a brother or father and even noted that Catherine couldn't have been the Cahterine born in 1749 and still have had Hannah in 1806.
Second, the Woolcott Genealogy, while it didnt list its references, was I think done very well and in did not jump to conclusions. this leads me to believe that it is a pretty accurate source (though as I said it didn't provide references).
Third, the baptism of Sebastian Dutcher (Gertrude Wheeler and Laurens Dutcher) and having John B. Wheeler and his wife as sponsors is the clincher. Sebastian is diffinately a Wheeler family name and used for several generations and John B. Wheeler was the only male on the wheeler side of the family (besides the grandfather sebastian). These three lead me to be as certain as I think we can be with a birth certificate or a missing Will.
c) As for providing a couple of generations of Wheeler's I'll see what I can do. I've so many and it was such a prolific family (the Progenator had something like 16 children) that I do't want to inundate you with data. It might be better for you to send me your Wheeler's and I'll see if they fit. But let me see what I can do (I have a few guesses in my database on some of the Wheeler placements and I don't like to pass on bum data and perpetuate my guesses or gut feel on stuff - I may have to take them out in what I post.)
Glenn